Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

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rafiki6
Posts: 427
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:40 am

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby rafiki6 » Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:36 pm

Even yesterday I met yet another person who avoids Poynton if possible because of its bewildering arrangement at the roundels. Signs that drivers give way to everyone/ you do not have priority are confusing. A traffic scheme's safety based on confusion is illogical even if it works. Why oh why a single large roundabout/roundel was not provided initially is beyond me: it's what most drivers are used to. The present acceptably shorter length of slow moving traffic queues through the town will reduce even more when the bypass is built. Fewer people will be confused - that must be good?
R

zzippy
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Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:27 pm
Location: The rough end of Poynton

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby zzippy » Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:31 pm

rafiki6 wrote:Even yesterday I met yet another person who avoids Poynton if possible because of its bewildering arrangement at the roundels.
.


Their loss, If you can't work out what is in essence a double mini roundabout similiar to one around Stoke on Trent for over 25 years then you have to ask yourself are they even fit to drive or hold a licence?

rafiki6 wrote: A traffic scheme's safety based on confusion is illogical even if it works. Why oh why a single large roundabout/roundel was not provided initially is beyond me: .


Surely you noticed it was/is an offset crossroads junction ?

What other option was there than to take out part of the Lynchgate and churchyard or flatten the whole row of buildings from next to the hairdressers to Bridgfords ( actually no real loss and could have been a bonus if not another million quid or so to buy the properties) :?:

And as you freely admit although unusual it works which is what matters :clap :clap

Working on a national level i can't even get luddites to look at more economical modern ways to keep traffic mooooooving due to vocal minority groups :evil:

Jugglingwithsanity
Posts: 77
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 3:46 pm

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby Jugglingwithsanity » Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:23 am

Yes it looks better, no it hasn't helped with the traffic levels (if that was ever cited for a reason to get rid of the lights.. Can't actually remember anymore.. They didn't really think about cyclists or judging by this video, partially sighted or blind people.. http://vimeo.com/118137432

ma-ogy
Posts: 1364
Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2009 7:23 pm

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby ma-ogy » Wed Feb 04, 2015 8:40 am

rafiki6 wrote:Even yesterday I met yet another person who avoids Poynton if possible because of its bewildering arrangement at the roundels. Signs that drivers give way to everyone/ you do not have priority are confusing. A traffic scheme's safety based on confusion is illogical even if it works. Why oh why a single large roundabout/roundel was not provided initially is beyond me: it's what most drivers are used to. The present acceptably shorter length of slow moving traffic queues through the town will reduce even more when the bypass is built. Fewer people will be confused - that must be good?
R

I agree, I too avoid the Fountainless place and the confusion at every possible opportunity , a single roundabout would have been the answer every driver knows how to negotiate a roundabout.

I

Poyntonresident
Posts: 437
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:36 pm

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby Poyntonresident » Wed Feb 04, 2015 9:30 am

If people avoid the roundels then that's fine and their choice. Judging by the sheer amount of vehicles passing through the junction however, there are plenty who don't avoid it - and in any case, I am sure there were just as many people avoided the old traffic light-controlled junction, so its not fair to criticise the new scheme on this basis.

I don't know what official statistics there are out there around traffic flow pre & post shared space, but anecdotally as someone who crosses Poynton several times each day in and out of rush hour, for me the time taken to get across the centre is less since shared space. Queues can appear to be longer than previously, but now they are moving slowly rather than being stationary for long periods while the lights were on red - the end result being a better throughput of vehicles.

Lets also not forget that one major reason for installing shared space was safety: again, not sure of the official stats, but i'd be surprised if they didn't show that since the scheme the number of serious incidents has reduced considerably. I accept there are probably more minor bumps and prangs (maybe caused by stupidity, but that's another matter...), but personally even if traffic flow was worsened by the new layout, I'd be happy to take this if I knew if lessened the chance of my family or friends coming to serious harm whilst out and about in the village.

boaBoy
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:00 am

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby boaBoy » Wed Feb 04, 2015 10:40 am

Thank you for all the responses - It seems that overall it is an improvement and whilst I dont think there can ever be a 'perfect' solution for traffic and people, the situation seems to be an improved one overall.

Our project is so different from yours in that there are no junctions that are massively changing, and even the creators of the scheme admit that traffic queues will most likely increase at peak times - so in that respect the experience for car drivers will not improve at all. We have narrow winding (2 way) streets and the plan is to replace 2 zebra crossings with 25 'courtesy' crossings - some of the roadway raised to pavement level, and drivers are expected to remain vigilant for pedestrians roaming around. Naturally, people are concerned about safety here and who has priority etc. I don't know which way I will vote - it seems on paper a good opportunity to refine the town centre and make it more pedestrian friendly, but at the same time pedestrians get here mostly by car and may be put off by even longer queuing times. It also seems we are pandering to lazy pedestrians who cannot be bothered to walk 10 metres to the zebra crossing in order to cross the road 'safely'.

The town seems divided but we'll see what happens on thursday...

thanks again for all your input

Al.

AnotherWhingerLike_U
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Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:17 pm

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby AnotherWhingerLike_U » Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:22 pm

nedsram wrote:.... There is an issue with people parking all over the pavement, ...... However it's a minor issue, and not one that has ever concerned me.....
:(
Unless you’re pushing a pram or trolley. :evil: The parking problem is probably not as serious as the reckless & dangerous way they mount the pavement. :twisted:

Wherever kerbs are dropped or removed, bollards should be added to protect the pavement. :ugeek: That appears to be what is done elsewhere in the superior shared space schemes. 8-)
Bramhall has added bollards and they don't even have a scheme.... :clap . :D

nedsram
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Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 6:35 pm
Location: Poynton (board admin)

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby nedsram » Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:38 pm

boaBoy wrote:the plan is to replace 2 zebra crossings with 25 'courtesy' crossings.

I'm glad that the various responses have been useful to you. As you can see, the majority are supportive of the scheme.

Regarding the above, this has been done on Park Lane, and works very well. Almost all drivers stop to allow pedestrians to cross. Of course the onus is on pedestrians to make sure that it's safe to cross before plunging into the road, but that's just common sense and applies everywhere.

To address a point somebody else made about blind people, the old main junction was a nightmare to cross even for able bodied, sighted pedestrians. Let's just say that if I was blind, which thankfully I'm not, I would have had severe difficulties with the old layout. The new layout is much more pedestrian friendly, and there is only ever a single lane of traffic to cross. There are tactile markings to indicate where the crossing points are located, and the position of these is obvious to drivers, the great majority of whom are only too happy to stop and let pedestrians cross. Disabled organisations were fully consulted during the design process.

As for the video, these were people visiting the area. I would have loved to have seen another video of them attempting to cross Park Lane at the main junction under the old system, with vehicles turning left at speed through a green light and expecting pedestrians to get out of the way. She would have found that really scary. More than once I had to abandon crossing there to avoid being hit by a left turning vehicle, where the driver "had the right of way because the light was green" and had no intention of stopping. (There was no "green man" here.)

ma-ogy
Posts: 1364
Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2009 7:23 pm

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby ma-ogy » Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:14 pm

I must point out that the responses on this forum are just the opinions of a very few of the people of Poynton and surrounding area's and not a representative survey of all the people who use the shared space.

It would be very interesting if the question was asked of all the resident and drivers who use the road , I wonder just what the results would be :?:

nedsram
Posts: 4869
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 6:35 pm
Location: Poynton (board admin)

Re: Does the Poynton Shared Space Scheme work?

Postby nedsram » Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:37 pm

Indeed, but human nature being what it is, a far higher percentage of those who dislike something tend to air their views compared with those who like it. Hence the term "silent majority". If the council is to be believed, feedback was overwhelmingly in favour. But then they would say that wouldn't they, I hear you say...


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